Eric Coppolino's Interview with Dr. Jonathan Jay Couey • Zero-Sum

From The Trouble with Physics by Lee Smolin

Interview with CHD’s and Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s scientific advisor, Dr. Jonathan Jay Couey

Robert F. Kennedy denies the virus existence problem. What does his science advisor know? Program notes and background information.

by Eric Coppolino | Jan 21, 2023

Dr. Jonathan Jay Couey, scientific advisor to Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. and to the organization Children’s Health Defense (CHD), first came onto my radar a couple of months ago when I read emails about him ridiculing someone named Christine Massey. By ridiculing, I mean brutally, and also deceiving his viewers about her and her findings. I am sure that examples will find their way into the comment section of this article.

As you listen, keep an ear for whether Dr. Couey offers any evidence of his many claims. He never cites a single study or paper, and he never provided me with any of the documents that he promised, nor has he sent Christine any of the studies or papers he promised. He refused to provide Planet Waves FM his CV, questioning why I would want to see it (since he is not applying for a job). We have, however, done our best to confirm that his his academic credentials are real.

My One Question to Dr. Couey’s Boss

When I had my one opportunity to ask Mr. Kennedy one question at a fundraising event in April 24, 2022, I chose to ask him about Christine’s work. My intent was to establish for sure the date, time and place where Mr. Kennedy was informed of this particular body of information — with plenty of witnesses present.

Christine and her colleagues around the world are asking governments and agencies the one question that forms the basis of all investigative reporting: where’s your data?

Using various Freedom of Information (FOI) laws, they query governments and health regulatory institutions everywhere, asking whether they have any record of a sample of SARS-CoV-2 taken from a human. Christine also asks if they have evidence in any scientific paper documenting that the claimed virus was ever extracted from a human host, created anywhere else, by anyone.

Unanimously, more than 200 of them have said no, we do not. Some have been queried many times, many ways, so the count is for agencies, not responses received.

The Same Institutions Said There Was a Virus

These are the very same institutions and governments who asserted, beginning in early 2020, that there was a virus, and that there was an urgent threat to human life, and therefore, they could put half the world under house arrest, lock down businesses, and cause incalculable harm, grief and loss of life.

Asked simply whether they have proof of their reason for taking these actions, they all say no. This is now a matter of intent: they knew or should have known they had no record of a virus, yet they seized power and acted on society anyway — granting themselves all kinds of legal indemnity and immunity along the way.

What occurred in 2020 was not, in Mr. Kennedy’s aching words, “a mismanaged pandemic.” All of the mitigation measures are now demonstrably deliberate, unnecessary acts that harmed nearly everyone, which has been obvious for a long time.

Based on the problem of foreknowledge, whole matter should go straight to the prosecutors. I am sure Mr. Kennedy’s father, who served as Attorney General of the United States, would have been infuriated by this disclosure. And, after he cooled off, I imagine he would have personally started drafting a criminal indictment against the government officials who defrauded the public by making and acting on such a false claim, resulting in incalculable loss to the nation and the world.

This matter also belongs on every page one in existence. It belongs not only in the corporate press but also on all of the “health freedom” channels and vlogs and blogs and casts and pods and panels as the most important disclosure to arise out of the rolling disaster we are living through.

But apart from a very few places who have given Christine air time, there is eerie silence that sounds like what it is: a coverup.

And in the case of Mr. Kennedy’s science advisor Dr. Jonathan Jay Couey, the matter is treated, in public, like a joke. In this respect, Dr. Couey is in the role not of science advisor but of a rodeo clown who is distracting a charging bull from trampling his boss.

CHD Conceals the FOI Project and its Implications

Where Mr. Kennedy, who serves as the publisher of many “news” outlets, enters the story personally is on April 24, 2022, when I asked him about this matter in person, to his face, with about 150 of his financial supporters in the room — in Greenwich, Connecticut.

Mr. Kennedy gave no coherent reply when I ask him to comment on all those governments and agencies saying sorry, no virus, and no record of one anywhere.

He could have said, “How interesting, we will look into it, thanks, next question please.” (I fully expected he would have been briefed to do just that.) Instead, his words in reply to my simple question were so inchoate that it took three hours to transcribe just three minutes — and then a couple of days more to verify every syllable.

You may listen for yourself and read the transcript of Mr. Kennedy outright dismissing the fact that all of the governments and health institutions in the world, when queried, say they have no record of actual virus taken from an actual human patient. This matches the fact that there were only excess deaths in 16 of the United States, which all began after mitigation measures were put into place.

Missing Virus Problem Shows Up Many Ways

It is not, by the way, simply on the basis of Christine’s work that we know this (as Dr. Couey asserts, as if we can end the matter by dismissing her). There are many pillars to this understanding.

Among them, I have spent three years analyzing how the “covid” PCR supposedly works, and the same conclusion is inevitable: it does not and cannot test for a virus or for any disease; there are no “positive” results possible, and this has been known since 2006 at latest. There are many other pillars that I have outlined in this article.

Meanwhile, Mr. Kennedy told me and his audience that the matter of the missing virus is handled on the CHD community listserve using mob rule — not cool, impartial scientific assessment of the kind that Mr. Kennedy assured his supporters (during the previous 90 minutes) he was eminently capable of.

I followed up by stating the obvious: The agencies and governments are admitting this themselves.

He then tried to argue that negative responses to FOI (freedom of information) requests are irrelevant. Yet previously, on the matter the New York State Department of Health saying it had no information about whether masks work or are safe, he said something different.

He wrote to his Instagram followers, “It erodes popular faith in democracy when public officials insist that their arbitrary policies are ‘science based’ and yet cannot produce a single study to support sweeping mandates. This letter illustrates the hazard of abandoning due process.”

I’ll say.

And in this particular case of the missing virus FOIs, we are not talking about something so seemingly trivial as face coverings. We are talking about the lack of a scientific basis for causing the grief, terror, loss and endless drama that we have all — all of us — been dragged through the past three years, with no end in sight, claims that were based on the alleged findings of science. Particularly of a virus.

Where is the Nuance? Maybe It’s Not There

CHD often blames its science advisors for their view that the missing virus problem lacks all merit.

Recently I read some words of Dr. Couey’s, which were ghost written for his bosses and sent to a small email group involving Christine, Mr. Kennedy and another top CHD official: “While we agree that there have been many, many lies during covid, we believe that the situation is complicated, and that the ‘no virus’ stance lacks sufficient nuance to the most viable position.”

Lacks sufficient nuance?

You certainly could say that — no means no.

As regards the existence of SARS-CoV-2 known to those who keep telling us that it exists, the matter is admitted and settled, unless we throw it back to all the biotech people who invented the thing themselves. They are an endless font of technical excuses, jargon, diversion and “in silico” sequences (that is, pretending computer code is a virus), for which Dr. Couey openly advocates in our conversation.

There is a samurai-like nuance in a widely published 2022 paper by Dr. Mark Bailey, A Farewell to Virology, which Dr. Couey said he had never heard of or read. Dr. Bailey takes on the claimed science of virology impeccably. Dr. Couey, by some miracle, was ignorant of this widely known work.

What is CHD’s Real Position on the Missing Virus Problem?

CHD is fond of saying in its publications that it takes no position on the virus existence issue (except for all the articles about viruses they post, asserting their existence). So this claimed policy is in itself deceptive.

Many outspoken figures take a public position and a private position on the same issue. Privately, Mr. Kennedy gives a very different answer than his roundabout stammering when I asked him about Christine’s work.

What is Mr. Kennedy’s private position, on the missing virus problem? Here it is, written last summer, provided to me by the recipient:

“I’m grateful for your courage and intellectual integrity. I have an open mind on this issue but no bandwidth to spend the time energy and credibility capital to personally investigate it. I feel the same way towards those people who passionately and knowledgeably argue that 9/11 is an inside job. It could be true. But there are opportunity costs in taking on this cause and I think diminishing returns to my overall effectiveness. I cannot right every wrong or expose every falsehood. I need to be strategic In choosing my battles. If you reflect, you will find that you do the same. I admire and encourage you but I must beg off on this war for the time being. I’m more likely to join if you get it nearer the goal line where the cost/returns ratio improves.”

Translating out of political jargon, he is saying: I know you’re right.

But taking on this admitted falsehood is too risky of a matter for him now in terms of “cost/returns ratio,” “opportunity costs” (that is, lost opportunities), “credibility capital” (his donors won’t believe him, or like his viewpoint) and “diminishing returns” (it may be a lost cause, or not a good fundraising tool).

These are all financial references. Most of Mr. Kennedy’s donors appear to be vehemently committed to the existence of viruses, which seem like the reincarnation of Elvis. Their views can partly be attributed to CHD’s publications not offering a clue that there’s any problem with the whole virus theory.

Instead, they read about viruses every single day in The Defender, one of Mr. Kennedy’s outlets. All he’s missing is a product line of virus cures.

Covid has been berry, berry good to him. CHD’s donation revenues have repeatedly doubled during the “pandemic crisis,” from just under $3 million in 2019 to more than $7 million in 2020 — just the first year of “covid” — according to tax documents. Revenue doubled again in 2021, reaching nearly $16 million. Where is all this public money invested? What exactly is it spent on?

While struggling Americans contribute to his charity, Kennedy’s personal salary from CHD has increased proportionally in that time, and is now nearly $500,000.

Yet the organization recently cut its modest funding to an important Substack that tracks vaccine deaths, claiming it was not capable of covering the cost due to budgetary constraints.

He Gets It

In his private email, Mr. Kennedy is saying: You guys (meaning the people who have done the work documenting the missing virus problem) can take the risk; you can take the hits while this issue is unpopular and even considered a little crackpot.

We are not going to help. But when you’ve paid the cost, and done all the real work, and have more of the public on board, and are “nearer the goal line,” we will then come in and take up the issue, which in political speech usually means, take over the issue.

In other words, he gets it.

He is admitting that the truth is known, and he knows it. However, it’s evidently not part of his editorial policy to be honest, despite the daily claims I see from him and his editors providing the uncensored truth.

By the way, Mr. Kennedy is not alone in this; all of the “big 10” covid truth organizations pretend a bird flew in the room when the missing virus FOIs come up. And in my view, they owe their public, at minimum, equal time for Christine to explain, without interruption, just what she has documented, and how she did it.

Then the responding agencies need to be contacted and an explanation demanded by someone sincere enough to keep asking the questons till they get a real answer.

Today, let’s find out what Mr. Kennedy’s science advisory department thinks about the issue, and several others. Put on your ears and sharpen your pencil.

Eric Francis Coppolino is a New York-based investigative reporter and radio host, executive director of Chiron Return, and author of the Covid Chronology. If you want to help support our reporting efforts, we would be most grateful.